Comparing diesel engines

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Comparing diesel engines

Postby crenshaw » Sat Apr 25, 2009 10:26 am

what is the difference between a diesel six cylinder engine and a in line six cylinder diesel engine? What advantage does one have on the other?
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Postby chiefss » Sat Apr 25, 2009 3:00 pm

they sound the same to me. You just transposed a couple words.
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Re: Comparing diesel engines

Postby Frank Klenk » Sun Apr 26, 2009 11:04 am

crenshaw wrote:what is the difference between a diesel six cylinder engine and a in line six cylinder diesel engine? What advantage does one have on the other?


Crenshaw
Reword the question for us. It doesn't make sense. Do you mean an inline 6 and a V6??
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Postby chiefss » Sun Apr 26, 2009 2:11 pm

Does anyone even make a V6 diesel??
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Postby Frank Klenk » Sun Apr 26, 2009 7:05 pm

Yep, Cummins has one in the works, might even be out already.
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Postby crenshaw » Sun Apr 26, 2009 7:20 pm

Clarifying the question... What is the difference between an inline 6 and a 6 cylinder engine.
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Postby chiefss » Sun Apr 26, 2009 10:22 pm

An inline 6 IS a six cylinder engine but not all 6 cylinder engines are inline. Some are a V configuration and some like the big Porche engines are flat or horizontally opposed engines. I even have an old M&M ignition engine that is a six cylinder radial.
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Postby ffkiwi » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:00 pm

chiefss wrote:Does anyone even make a V6 diesel??


The M113 series of light armoured vehicles are powered by Detroit 6V53T diesels (and Allison auto transmissions) I believe the same setup is used in a lot of passenger buses.
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Postby loucrane » Mon May 04, 2009 3:16 pm

Crenshaw, Chiefss and Frank...

Apparently, there is some usage of calling a VEE layout engine an inline, if the banks each have cylinders in a line parallel to the crankshaft... First time I saw this was in regard to the R-R Merlin engines, and it apparently was also used to describe some of the other VEE format engines used in the Schneider Cup racing floatplanes.

I'd felt more comfortable calling in in-line layout that which has all its cylinders in line, parallel to the crankshaft, in a single bank.

Hmmm...
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Postby chiefss » Mon May 04, 2009 3:48 pm

"I'd felt more comfortable calling in in-line layout that which has all its cylinders in line, parallel to the crankshaft, in a single bank."

That's exactly what an inline engine is. One row of cylinders parallel to the crankshaft.

A V engine has two rows angled away from each other. Most car engines today are 90 degrees to each other but the angle can very. The old Cadillac V16's were 45 degrees. The cylinders make a VEE when related to the crankshaft.

Now here's one for you. A Fairbanks Morse submarine diesel has 10 cylinders and 20 pistons. An eight cylinder has 16 and a 12 Cylinder has 24 pistons. They are inline engines.
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Postby loucrane » Tue Jun 02, 2009 12:15 am

Chiefss,

Sounds to me like the Fairbanks Morse also has two parallel shafts, each one driving one of the two pistons in its cylinder... Common combustion chamber...

Somewhere, I've seen that such a layout HAS been done...
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Postby chiefss » Tue Jun 02, 2009 9:21 am

Like I said. Fairbanks Morse has been uing that type of engine since at least WWII. The newest US submarines including the OHIO class Tridents and the Seawolf Class use Fairbanks Morse engines. The Tridents have 12 cylinder engines. There is a crankshaft on the top and one on the bottom. Common cylinder with two pistons in each. The bore is 10.5 inches.
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Postby blacksea7 » Sun Jan 03, 2010 7:30 pm

Guess I should add something to this.
Inline 6 has six independent throws thereby making it inherently balanced without the need for balance shafts... as perfect as it gets.
Flat 6 will use a 3 throw counter weighted crank. 6 throw shafts exist as well and are incredibly balanced (again, six throws, not 3) Three throw cranks are not inherently balanced however they can be engineered to do the job without being offensive. Balance shafts are a great solution.
V-6, with a 60 degree bank isn't a balanced engine. They need balance shafts to quell the frequencies that'd bother you however internally the engine is literally thrashing. When they break they usually do on the number 5 journal.
V-6 with a 90 degree bank isn't balanced and makes for a rough running engine at idle.. the way to get around it is to step the idle up or, which is an industry standard, split the crank pin 15 degrees... is a fantastic solution to the issue... none the less frequency issue exist as well.
The new series of V-6 diesels by duramax and cummins suffer from the same effects however due to reasonable piston speeds .. or limited RPM, it's not such an issue as in a gas engine spinning over 6K.
For the money, the inline is the best deal... not only is the Inline Cummins the most tried and proven of the offerings it's inherently balanced... add to it, maintenance is a breeze.
One way to think of it is any imbalance or frequency is a waste of energy as some of the fuel burned is consumed in excessive friction, imbalance, etc... I admit they've come a long way since GM was taking short cuts with their insanely huge 4.1 thrashing about under the hood........
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